That’s the part I never understood. Even if you weren’t a Musk fan boy and before Musk showed his true colors, Telsa has always, ALWAYS been shit quality. I remember back in 2015, or so, there was a video of someone finally getting their Telsa and it had a massive crack running the length of the driver side A-pillar, yet they just ignored it.
Tesla is basically a case study in top down engineering. Radical ideas promised by marketing, sometimes good and sometimes bad, executed in a massive fucking rush which results in tons of build quality and general delivering on promises issues.
It was more to do with hubris. Scaling up production of anything as complex as a car is going to result in quality issues unless your production engineers are world-class. Tesla thought they were smarter than the carmakers, and learned early in the process that that was bullshit. Then Musk came in and relied on hype rather than engineering to move units.
Which only worked at first because they were a start up. At that point many people will accept the early adopter woes, but Tesla never quite matured out of it.
yep. They rested on their laurels, thinking their success of being first would always be success.
and now the big automakers have their own electric cars, that are properly built, and damn cheap compared to tesla prices.
and the first tesla musk had any design input on was the cybertruck, which is nothing more than the fever dream of an edgy emotionally stunted 13 year old, and built to about the same quality as you would expect from one
I’ll have to be honest and admit back when I was in high school or so, I was enthusiastic about electric cars and his seemed like some of the best. He was also opening up the charging standards so that there could be a mixed playing field. Back then, I was likely ready to dismiss small critiques as the retaliation of the fossil fuel industry.
Tesla was a long way ahead of the competition for a very long time, to the point where they were the only option for a vehicle that was genuinely a replacement for a combustion vehicle.
Without them, I very much doubt EV market share would be anywhere near what it is today.
The EV1 was too far ahead of its time. The tech wasn’t there and to even accomplish what they did cost far more than they could hope to sell it for.
An estimate that each EV1 cost GM around $100k to make in the early 90’s (so around $200k in today’s dollars).
Battery tech has progressed massively since then and makes all of this possible now (even if it’s still expensive).
Range is important, but so is cost. Teslas are too expensive for Leaf owners.
My 7 seat EV only does at most 150 miles. But even now, two years later, there isn’t anything else that comfortably fits 7 adults. Let alone not over twice the price. So 200 miles seams ok to me.
I agree standard charger connectors are important. But CHAdeMO is standard, just not in Europe or North America. Can’t blame the Leaf for not knowing that would happen.
The Leaf is also one of the very few cars, least in the UK, which can be using bidirectionally.
https://www.indra.co.uk/v2g/
I don’t own a Leaf, but I respect what they did. You see loads of them here.
It has been, but the leaf was very much a “second car” for a very long time. They had relatively short range, an air cooled battery, and as a result couldn’t be charged particularly fast. The battery would also overheat if you tried to charge it multiple times.
Tesla, on the water, had a water cooled battery pack, and could be fast charged multiple times per day, and much faster than other vehicles, meaning a road trip was actually possible.
The Leaf was cheap. It introduced many to EVs. They are super common third or fourth hand now. It was aimed at the other end of the market than the Tesla.
All your reasons were valid though. Teslas were the best electric cars for a long time, probably not so anymore. Tesla as a brand has done good things, like you say opening up their charging standard which is superior to all the other competitors.
Personally, I wouldn’t get a Tesla because they are sort of like the apple of car companies, e.g. anti-consumer and anti-repair. Plus, Musk owning it is another big negative.
Take it from an old man, at a certain point you will grow beyond having to feel “embarassed” by your former self, because your ego won’t be tied to it.
Old man here as well. I follow the doctrine of non-repudiation: I did a lot of stupid things when I was young. But I own them and don’t hate my former self for doing them. Mind you, I didn’t hurt anyone (except emotionally, and not intentionally) and wasn’t a criminal. If that were different, maybe I’d have to process it differently.
I think you can understand something without embracing it or condoning it. I did a few bad things, it’s understandable that kids with that age and upbringing will, as long as you own what you did, put right what you can and atone for the rest, there’s no need to hate yourself.
That’s the part I never understood. Even if you weren’t a Musk fan boy and before Musk showed his true colors, Telsa has always, ALWAYS been shit quality. I remember back in 2015, or so, there was a video of someone finally getting their Telsa and it had a massive crack running the length of the driver side A-pillar, yet they just ignored it.
If you were an EV early adopter, Tesla is the only brand that delivered the range.
So, they were the only game in town for a lot of buyers.
Not nearly as big a problem now. Tesla has real competition which is why sales are crashing.
The Roadsters were well-made. That was when production volumes were low and Musk hadn’t bought the company yet.
Tesla is basically a case study in top down engineering. Radical ideas promised by marketing, sometimes good and sometimes bad, executed in a massive fucking rush which results in tons of build quality and general delivering on promises issues.
It was more to do with hubris. Scaling up production of anything as complex as a car is going to result in quality issues unless your production engineers are world-class. Tesla thought they were smarter than the carmakers, and learned early in the process that that was bullshit. Then Musk came in and relied on hype rather than engineering to move units.
Which only worked at first because they were a start up. At that point many people will accept the early adopter woes, but Tesla never quite matured out of it.
yep. They rested on their laurels, thinking their success of being first would always be success.
and now the big automakers have their own electric cars, that are properly built, and damn cheap compared to tesla prices.
and the first tesla musk had any design input on was the cybertruck, which is nothing more than the fever dream of an edgy emotionally stunted 13 year old, and built to about the same quality as you would expect from one
I’ll have to be honest and admit back when I was in high school or so, I was enthusiastic about electric cars and his seemed like some of the best. He was also opening up the charging standards so that there could be a mixed playing field. Back then, I was likely ready to dismiss small critiques as the retaliation of the fossil fuel industry.
God I hate old me.
Tesla was a long way ahead of the competition for a very long time, to the point where they were the only option for a vehicle that was genuinely a replacement for a combustion vehicle.
Without them, I very much doubt EV market share would be anywhere near what it is today.
I’m not sure how it even managed to get so big when the EV1 was so beloved but supposedly killed by the automotive industry.
The EV1 was too far ahead of its time. The tech wasn’t there and to even accomplish what they did cost far more than they could hope to sell it for. An estimate that each EV1 cost GM around $100k to make in the early 90’s (so around $200k in today’s dollars).
Battery tech has progressed massively since then and makes all of this possible now (even if it’s still expensive).
Don’t know about that. Leaf has been pretty important as well.
Even now, the Leaf only goes 200 miles. Less than a 2018 Model 3. Not good enough.
I agree, Tesla was the viable option fora long time. The charging network is part of that even still.
The NACS connector is a big deal.
Range is important, but so is cost. Teslas are too expensive for Leaf owners.
My 7 seat EV only does at most 150 miles. But even now, two years later, there isn’t anything else that comfortably fits 7 adults. Let alone not over twice the price. So 200 miles seams ok to me.
I agree standard charger connectors are important. But CHAdeMO is standard, just not in Europe or North America. Can’t blame the Leaf for not knowing that would happen.
The Leaf is also one of the very few cars, least in the UK, which can be using bidirectionally. https://www.indra.co.uk/v2g/
I don’t own a Leaf, but I respect what they did. You see loads of them here.
Leaf’s tech was a joke for a long time.
Yes, because it was cheap.
It has been, but the leaf was very much a “second car” for a very long time. They had relatively short range, an air cooled battery, and as a result couldn’t be charged particularly fast. The battery would also overheat if you tried to charge it multiple times.
Tesla, on the water, had a water cooled battery pack, and could be fast charged multiple times per day, and much faster than other vehicles, meaning a road trip was actually possible.
The Leaf was cheap. It introduced many to EVs. They are super common third or fourth hand now. It was aimed at the other end of the market than the Tesla.
All your reasons were valid though. Teslas were the best electric cars for a long time, probably not so anymore. Tesla as a brand has done good things, like you say opening up their charging standard which is superior to all the other competitors.
Personally, I wouldn’t get a Tesla because they are sort of like the apple of car companies, e.g. anti-consumer and anti-repair. Plus, Musk owning it is another big negative.
Just like model ts were the best for a long time because they were the only ones.
tesla just had good marketing, while thier TESLAS have been lacking QC for quite a while.
You’re always supposed to hate or be embarrassed by the old you; that means you learned. It means growth. It’s a good thing.
Take it from an old man, at a certain point you will grow beyond having to feel “embarassed” by your former self, because your ego won’t be tied to it.
Old man here as well. I follow the doctrine of non-repudiation: I did a lot of stupid things when I was young. But I own them and don’t hate my former self for doing them. Mind you, I didn’t hurt anyone (except emotionally, and not intentionally) and wasn’t a criminal. If that were different, maybe I’d have to process it differently.
Probably not that much different tbh.
I think you can understand something without embracing it or condoning it. I did a few bad things, it’s understandable that kids with that age and upbringing will, as long as you own what you did, put right what you can and atone for the rest, there’s no need to hate yourself.