On the flip side, it says that a person can use force, including deadly force, to prevent death or harm to themselves or another person.
So hypothetically, your doctor, is using lethal force, to prevent the person inside you from harming you.
Totally legal as the law is written.
IANAL ; best option is to move out of regressive states, and set the place on fire before you leave.
the law is a tool wielded against the working class by the ruling class, it will never protect you from them
to defeat fascism, you must organize. running away and random acts of violence accomplish nothing.
it is coming for you, wherever you run to.
join the IWW and get involved in local activist groups
More accurately: someone raped a 14 year old girl, the pregnancy has become ectopic. The punishment for trying to save her life is worse than the person who raped a 14 year old.
I can’t even… Use of deadly force to save a baby in a mother’s womb? Are you like supposed also do a C-section right there on the spot so that the mother dies but the baby is fine?
Keep in mind, this is deadly force to prevent an abortion. Abortions are only done during the time that child is unviable. Essentially no providers give abortions past 24 weeks. So, even if you use deadly force to prevent an abortion, the baby is pretty much gauranteed to be unable to survive outside the mother at that point. You are then undoubtedly killing both mother and fetus.
haha I hadn’t even factored that in, so insane…
Sounds like a fitting addition to the repo men scenario. Sadly this is reality.
Here is the proposed text of the NC state constitutional amendment affirming personhood at conception, then including:
Any person has the right to defend his or her own life or the life of another person, even by the use of deadly force if necessary, from willful destruction by another person.
Here is the NC Dept. of Health and Human Service’s required abortion information describing the state’s abortion laws. They ban after 12 weeks, with exceptions for rape and incest before 20 weeks, and life-threatening anomalies before 24 weeks.
Here from the Raleigh Observer quoting state democratic lawmaker Rep. Julie von Haefen:
Von Haefen said the bill is a distraction from other bills being voted on and passed, including multiple constitutional amendments concerning unions and taxes, at least some of which will be on the ballot for North Carolinians to weigh. She said the amendments “are being used to drive conservative voter turnout.”
And here is my take: NC state republicans use women’s healthcare as a political pawn for pushing anti-worker and anti-tax interests, which neatly encapsulates the US culture war for the past 60 years. This bill will not pass, because it is insane, but it may succeed in its intent: looting the pockets of the people of NC.
This bill will not pass, because it is insane, but it may succeed in its intent: looting the pockets of the people of NC.
how many times have we said “It wont happen, it cant happen, its too insane” in the past 10 years? only for it to very much happen?
Shoot for the Gilead. If you miss, you still land among the capitalist nightmare hellscape.
“Our first mistake was teaching them to read. We won’t do that again”
If it’s to drive voter turnout, it’s also to keep Roy Cooper from flipping a US Senate seat
Have you met the voters of North Carolina?
From a practical standpoint how does one prevent the death of an unborn child via the use of deadly force against its mother?
The purpose of their anti-abortion policies has always been to control women. They’re finally comfortable dropping the pretext of caring about babies.
I think its more about legalizing shooting doctors. What a healthy country we live in.
Why stop there? They can’t work if their equipment and ward isn’t clean… kill the cleaners!
What about farmers supplying abortion doctors with food and goods?
Good point. Best shoot them too
So is this just another one of those cases where Texas or one of the other mad Max worshipping chaos states, is trying to implement its law nationally.
It’s a law legalizing the murder of Planned Parenthood staff and Democrats who want to overturn the law.
Shhhhhh logic isn’t allowed in this bill
That shows just how much they genuinely care for the life of the fetus. If the woman wants/needs to abort then it’s wrong. But if the woman wants/needs to abort then both lives are now forfeit
I swear to god they’re trying to legislate a civil war. They preach us vs them political rhetoric and want everyone running around with a gun. What a shit time to call yourself an American, but then again I’m not sure there ever was a good time.
I swear to god they’re trying to legislate a civil war.
Yes. Thats what they want. They want a mass uprising that they can use to suspend rule of law, elections, etc, so trump can become el’ presidente’ for life and commence to doing whatever the republicans want to do, free from oversight of law, courts, etc.
I suddenly want to play Tropico.
trump can become el’ presidente’ for life
Honestly, I wouldn’t be opposed to that, so long as the two-term-limit remains effective…
I think its also them seeing vigilantism as a way to get around constitutional requirements like due process and the 8th amendment. This is the kind of law people created by people who see the constitution as an obstacle.
It is somewhat comforting that they still see the constitution as a barrier to the hellscape they envision for society.
Playing around with the monopoly of violence in the US strikes me as a bad idea.
But yes, they’re mobilizing the klan again.
The kuck klan aren’t the only ones with firearms and unfortunately for them people that hate the klan are arming themselves at a high rate.
I think this pieces of shit see the handmaid’s tale as a manual and not as a warning.
Is this just a way to shoot your pregnant mistress for free?
It’s basically an excuse to shoot any woman, anytime, so long as you can conceive of a way to claim that you thought she was seeking an abortion. It would be a prosecutorial nightmare, at best, and open season on women at worst.
Only if she’s trying to get an abortion
What’s she going to do? Testify she wasn’t?
We should probably try to find the girlfriend of this bill’s sponsor. I’m concerned for her safety.
No, because that will terminate the pregnancy too. But since people are stupid, that’s how they will read it (as the upvotes prove).
It’s about shooting the doctor performing it and arresting women wanting it.
Only if you leave her brain dead. You kill the baby as well and it’s first degree murder
Killing live people - women, children, POCs, poor, other countries, etc - has always been acceptable and even promoted by Republicans. It’s only ending potential pregnancies when they “care” about lives. Except of course when it’s their wife, mistress, daughter who wants an abortion, then it’s ok.
The Only Moral Abortion Is My Abortion
This is 26 years old and still worth your time if you’ve never read it.
has always been acceptable by
RepublicansAmericansFixed that for you
If I were to summarize how this fits into long term republican vision of society it would be the following.
“Abortion, like healthcare, home ownership, and free speech is a thing we should reserve solely to for the wealthy and anybody making less than 2 million a year should not have access to any of these things”
2 million a year is a close to perfect way to divide the owning class for the rest of us. A surgeon has more in common with a grocery store clerk than a CEO and people really don’t understand that.
Honestly in some ways the actual number doesn’t matter, if you earn your living by selling your labor for a salary or wages you aren’t the problem
I would agree. The TEM (temporarily embarrassed millionaire) problem is particularly visible in corporate middle management and small business owners.
“Rules for thee, not for me.”
It should be remembered its always an elitist view when people view a subset of the population as unable to appreciate, unworthy to have or ‘going to far with’ a freedom.
Wouldn’t the use of deadly force to prevent the abortion actually aid the abortion?
Look, if they thought things through they wouldn’t be Republicans.
I’m increasingly the opinion that Republicans don’t actually know where babies come from.
I mean Republicans are stupid and all but I think they’re intending for this to be a deterrent. It’s a stupid and cruel deterrent, but it’s probably not meant to somehow kill the woman without killing the baby.
it might not be meant for that, but it will be used to excuse that
essentially through the entire pregnancy people will get to be terrified as all it’d take to legally murder them would be making them look like they wanted an abortion
I’m pretty sure that I saw a depressing statistic about the number of pregnant women getting murdered now. An unfortunate number of men murder their pregnant wives/girlfriends.
This could be a completely serious Orphan Crushing Machine solution in the minds of conservative basic dickheads.
“If somebody is already gonna go out in a blaze of glory, why not point them towards doctors and women’s healthcare rather than schools? Nailed it.”
Replace Republicans with Americans.
They share the blame.
this is all conservatives, americans isnt unique to anti-abortions.
She doesn’t even need to be pregnant, you just have to claim to believe she was about to commit an abortion. Free women murders for everyone!
It’s worse when you realize the bill isn’t about the woman, but her doctor.
Well that explains why it’s ok to kill a woman and therefore her fetus to prevent her from killing her fetus. It’s not, but you can keep every abortion doctor in the area to prevent them from performing the procedure.
Do you have to have “standing”? Like do you actually have to even know the woman or is this just an open bounty on doctors?
We already have a shortage of doctors as a whole and obstetricians have been fleeing red states for years now…
It doesn’t sound like Hate, it sounds like Slavery.
Hate would be activelly going out and trying to kill women, whilst punishing them for not letting their bodies be used by others as objects is, IMHO, much more a Slaver’s take on other human beings.
A Slaver’s motivation would also be pretty in tune with Tradition for Republican members of the power elites in North Carolina.
It’s a different and more complicated kind of hate. I find it useful to split bigotry into bigotry to dominate and bigotry to exterminate. American racism towards black people is the former, while American racism towards indigenous people is the latter.
Misogyny is almost always about domination, but it’s a unique kind because they can’t switch to extermination or even bluff it. They can’t hide women away to exist quietly in the background. They’re fully dependent on women to reproduce, and for most misogynistic men, for sexual pleasure. Many of them resent that they’re dependent on those they see as inferior for such things and that they can be leveraged.
So yeah, this is hate, just a hate that they can deny because they don’t want to think that they hate women, just women’s independence.
God this is a good comment
Well, I suppose the broader point I’m making is that it’s Sociopathy/Psychopathy.
The most harm done to people (I would even say, the most Evil) comes from people who couldn’t care less for how other people feel because they have no Empathy with other people’s suffering, and thus when they can will do whatever to others for their own personal upsides, even if those “upsides” are only satisfying their own personal petty psychological desires such as those you point out.
Hate actually involves some element of thinking of and caring about the other person (though a negative “caring”, of the “I want to make them suffer”), a kind of Evil which is very rare in real life even if it’s the most common in the movie “evil guy” stereotype.
As I’ve learned (from amongst other things working in the Finance Industry), the most common Evil is people knowingly doing things harmful to others to make money for themselves, get (more) power and influence or simply satisfy petty internal desires such as wanting to feel dominance over others (this later being, IMHO, the core of Moralism).
That’s fair, but we also don’t know that he doesn’t actively hate women. Just because you don’t want someone dead doesn’t mean you don’t have active hatred for them.
Most evil is banal, but quite a few people move to hating groups that they initially were hurting out of self interested gain. I’ve seen plenty of hate and it’s often a means of bypassing empathy for some reason or another
Removing the remnants of a miscarriage is also coded as an abortion. So theres still plenty of hate in this bill as well.
Hopefully they won’t pass a law requiring shotgun weddings in the case of pregnancy.
Abortions are actually very common due to miscarriages. I was personally affected by this and was present for a 9 month old abortion of a stillbirth. Even though my wife gave birth it was classified as an abortion because the baby had passed. We even have a abortion certificate.
So, according to proposed law a gunman could enter the hospital and kill the doctors, nurses, my wife and me in order to stop an abortion of a dead baby.
Makes perfect sense.
You’ve also got to remember that most of these people have never had a proper relationship with a woman in their lives, so they wouldn’t know about any of this.
